SU Rule Changes

[e30Racer]

The SEDIV Time Trial Committee is considering proposed rules changes to the Street Unlimited Class to go into effect in 2016. The current rules are found below in italics. The new rules propose to limit the type of cars from "anything and everything" to production-based cars. Additionally, the rules look to make it easier for new participants to clearly understand the rules and to provide more succinct guidelines for what can and cannot be done.

As members, we want to know your thoughts and input. What do you like, what do you not like. You don't have to be a current SU driver to comment. Those who are thinking about TT in the future are free to comment. This may be a class that you are interested in and if so, please provide us with your feedback. The proposed rules are attached and can be downloaded. Your input will help shape what goes in to the final rule set, or maybe the whole thing gets scrapped and we keep what we have. That's why we are asking you!

Thanks for your time!

CURRENT SU Rules:

Vehicles in this class should be titled and registered for use on public roads or have the ability to do so. It is intended as a class for street type cars whose modifications prevent them from finding a place in one of the historically available street type classes. Vehicles with an existing SEDIV SM Solo1/TT level 3 or 4 logbook are grandfathered into SU per the owner’s decision to change to this class and an inspection to a licensed Time Trial inspector. Vehicles in this class must have working brake lights and windshield wipers. With the exception of kit cars entering the class prior to 1/1/1999, a safety glass windshield is required. All lights required for street registration must be present and functional. Safety equipment should match performance potential. At a minimum, safety equipment must meet the requirements in the current SCCA Time Trial Rules for solo Street Modified cars.

Tires – Vehicles in this class must use a DOT rated tire.

Interior – Dashboard must remain intact. Kit type cars must have a dashboard. Carpet, insulation, passenger seating, etc. may be removed. No sharp edges should remain within driver's reach. Doors may be gutted only if cage is installed and side bars protrude into this area. Additional bulkheads or modifications to bulkheads to seal passenger compartment are allowed. Unsealed holes in the floorboard or firewall are not allowed.

Mufflers – Mufflers may be modified, substituted or removed for events. This does not supersede event noise requirements.

[zukitek]

I am fine with the proposed rules changes _so far_. I like the fact that it confines the class to production cars rather than the free for all that it is right now which allows pretty much anything that can be construed as street legal to be in SU. I compete in a car that I can drive anywhere and anytime so I am all for keeping that playing field level.

Are we going to make brakes free? I guess the rule about all lights for street legal cars being present and operational makes using a headlight hole as an air intake illegal haha. I didn't really know that was a rule until I read them.

[e30Racer]

Yes brakes are free. They are not mentioned bc there is nothing that is restricting them. There are definitely some creative ways to get around using a headlight as an opening for an intake and still have a functioning headlight.

[RoccoB]

At first glance I don't see anything that seems at all unreasonable. I'm curious as to how better clarifying the rules will change the dynamic of the class, considering it really is a catch all for cars that, like Ricky's, are swapped DD's and cars like mine that are street legal (by "classic car" standards) and don't fit anywhere else either. In my opinion the most interesting thing about SU is that being in a fully stripped race car doesn't guarantee being among the fastest in class, but what it does do for people like myself is allow the freedom to take a 25 year old chassis and do what needs to be done for it to have a shot at hanging with more modern drivetrains.

All in all, as much as I think running autoX and club racing classes is brilliant because it allows an easier transition between different disciplines, I think the Power/Weight with points system of classifying keeps the playing field much more level. Either way it will probably never be level.

Anyway, back to the rules.

One thing I noticed was that there isn't an allowance for modifying floor pans to allow clearance for exhaust. In a class with so many swaps that require custom exhausts, that might be something to address.

I'll look it over more and try to provide more feedback.

[e30Racer]

Thanks for your input Rocco. We did consider making an allowance for modifying the floor pan for an exhaust, but didn't include that just because we weren't sure how necessary it really was. It has been brought up in other conversations recently that there may be one competitor (Lane Cameron) who does have a modified floor pan for his exhaust. But that is something that can be discussed and changed possibly.

Does it bother you that we have limited the wing/spoiler height to the roofline of the car? I know that the last time I saw your car the wing was maybe a couple inches higher than the roof.

[rodhx]

Yes brakes are free. They are not mentioned bc there is nothing that is restricting them. There are definitely some creative ways to get around using a headlight as an opening for an intake and still have a functioning headlight.

Just a suggestion...Given the common approach of the SCCA rulebooks as a set of allowances, how can not mentioning brakes mean they are free? To be consistent I think I would specifically allow it.

[RoccoB]

Does it bother you that we have limited the wing/spoiler height to the roofline of the car? I know that the last time I saw your car the wing was maybe a couple inches higher than the roof.

Actually, I didn't notice mention of the roof line in the rules you sent in the email. All I saw was:
"2. Wings and/or spoilers may be used and are unlimited. However, a wing or spoiler may not protrude more than 6 inches beyond the side or rear bodywork of the vehicle. Active Aero is prohibited."

That would suck a little for me if I want to jump back and forth between NASA and SCCA, because NASA allows no part of the wing more than 8" above the roof line. So basically I'd need to have two totally different wing setups and switch back and forth. But hey, if that's what I need to do that's what I need to do. Currently my airfoil is dead level with the highest point of the roof line, and the end-plates are 3.5" above that point.

I'm also curious about the very descriptive use of "tube chassis". For instance, I recently replaced my stock rad support with a tube support that can be bolted in (previous was welded into place) so that I can more easily access the engine for service and have more room to safely mount my radiator (previously fan drive was less than 1/4" from the rad). Does that count as a partial tube chassis? Does it matter that it is supported by tubing that runs back to the firewall, as would be the case with any 12-point rollcage?

I think the allowance of floor pan modification for engine swaps is important not only for current competitors, but for future ones also. It is pretty commonplace to need to alter the pan in some way, whether that be cutting and welding or "massaging" with a hammer, to make an exhaust fit with a swap.

[e30Racer]

That is a valid point Rod, but since this is a Regional Class, we are not held to the same standard as what SCCA National requires. As for consistency in reading with GCR or Solo classes, we could maintain the same philosophy that unless it's stated, you can't modify, replace, or otherwise mess with it.

The current SU rules have taken the opposite approach, even though it's not really stated. Everything in the current SU rules is completely free to modify unless specifically stated. We were following this approach and then stating what was being limited for the most part.
Maybe what should be stated at the beginning of the rules is that the philosophy of this set of rules is "everything is freely available for modification, replacing, etc" unless otherwise stated." By coming from the other direction, "unless stated you can't touch it," we would end up having an extremely long set of rules since this is more of an "unlimited" class. To me, it's easier to come from "everything is unlimited unless..." than the other way. For example, the proposed rules does not mention brakes, subframes, engine mounting points, bushings, cooling system, oil system, interior gauges, seats, steering wheels, shifter kits, wheels, exterior emblems, electrical systems, or other suspension components like toe links, etc. If we took the side that SCCA National does for consistency, we would have to address every component mentioned above.

It's a fair question to ask, how would you feel about having a disclaimer at the beginning in order to keep the rules as short as possible, or is consistency with national rules more important?

[e30Racer]

Rocco, I was mistaken haha. The guy who wrote the rules forgot what he included and didn't include. We talked about making the rule that the wing could not be higher than the roofline, but we didn't include it. I just went back and looked and it's not there. So you're good on that part.

As for the floorpan, check out rule C(7) which states allowed modifications for the floor pan. It says, "Modifications to allow for the installation of a fuel cell, roll cage, seat mounting, or air jacks are permitted." If people want, we could add exhaust system to that list.

[rodhx]

It's a fair question to ask, how would you feel about having a disclaimer at the beginning in order to keep the rules as short as possible, or is consistency with national rules more important?

I think that would be good for the sake of consistency. Regional class or not, if you're going to have the exact opposite approach as the GCR & Solo rulesets then that should be stated very clearly.

[zukitek]

I agree with making the ruleset as short and to the point as needed. I have always disagreed with the premise of if its not expressly allowed in the rules then its disallowed. I don't think we need to overthink it . Lets just put in the exceptions and let the rest be assumed as unlimited. All we are doing in my eyes are setting a couple boundaries to exclude scratch built tube chassis race cars and making sure that a prod car isnt cut down to the trans tunnel and built back as a tube frame car.

The only reason I mentioned brakes is because Ive been doing so much in that area lately. I was curious.

[e30Racer]

I tend to agree with Ricky. But that's why we want this feedback so keep it coming.

[rodhx]

I agree with keeping simple as well. My only caution is the current approach runs counter to all the other rulesets so it seems to be begging for confusion. All that is needed is a sentence at the beginning stating that anything is allowed other than the listed set of limitations.

[Fusion Works]

Sounds like we borrowed heavily on the rules from Global Time Attack.

Does this rule out Locost 7 Type cars?

Leave the aero rules alone or add an exclusion for hatchbacks if you change the rule regarding mounting height. We can't easily put a hatch back wing below the hatch and still have the 6in extension rule met.

Can we pull the rule about where exhausts exit? This excludes hood dump or front fender dump for a turbo car. Everyone likes to see flames shooting out of their race car.

[87RX7RACER]

For what it's worth, here is the response that I forwarded to Mark for everyone's consideration:

PROPOSED Street Unlimited Class Rules

A. Chassis

1. Vehicles must be mass production road going vehicles constructed by a recognized manufacturer and currently/previously available as a factory OEM vehicle with a government mandated VIN# or equivalent. Vehicles must have the ability to be registered legally for street use. Tube chassis, open wheel or club racer cars that may be made street legal are not allowed. (i.e. Radical SR3, Factory 5 818, Ultimate GTR, Aerial Atom, etc.) We may want to consider re wording this. What if someone has a JDM vehicle that doesn’t have a government issued “VIN”?

3. The OEM floor pan and shock tower location (or shock location equivalent if not equipped with shock towers) must remain intact and unmodified. 4. All vehicles must have a silhouette that is largely faithful to the original with the general body shape and outline remaining largely true to the original stock body. Not really sure what you are trying to accomplish here.

6. Factory firewall may be modified to allow for the roll cage to continue into the engine bay, for service related reasons, and for fitment of alternate engine and transmission. These modifications are limited to the minimum required to accomplish the above and firewall must be resealed to provide an adequate level of safety in the event of an engine bay fire. I think this is a slippery slope here. I can’t really think of a reason why a roll cage would need to enter the engine compartment to facilitate an engine swap. Either we allow roll cage bars in the engine compartment or we don’t.

7. At a minimum, safety equipment must meet the requirements in the current SCCA Time Trial Rules for Track Trials and Hill Climbs. The SCCA Time Trial Rules covers information regarding roll bars/cages, fire protection, driver restraint/protection, etc. Pretty sure this is already covered in the GCR, no need to re mention here.


C. Exterior/Aero

2. Wings and/or spoilers may be used and are unlimited. However, a wing or spoiler may not protrude more than 6 inches beyond the side or rear bodywork of the vehicle. Active Aero is prohibited. Is it really necessary to restrict “Active Aero”?

6. OEM front and rear shock towers must remain intact. All vehicles must use the OEM front and rear shock towers in the OEM locations. Shocks/struts must attach to these towers and must pass through the original hole in the towers. The shock tower may be modified to install shock mount reinforcement, spacers, or camber/caster plates, but the OEM structure must remain in place. On some vehicles, it is necessary to move the holes or re-drill them to bolt on certain caster/camber plates.


D. Engine/Drivetrain/Fuel

1. Engine Swaps are open. If an engine and or transmission swap is performed, the new engine and transmission should be installed close to the OEM engine and transmission location. Engine swaps are to be of the same configuration (Front-engine to Front-engine, Rear-engine to Rear-engine). Turbocharging and supercharging are allowed. Differentials and gearing ratios (transmission or differential) may be changed. If someone is going through the trouble of an engine swap, why should we restrict them to moving the engine farther backwards? Remember, you already covered leaving the floor structure OEM (which should include the trans tunnel)-so if there is some free space available-why should we restrict that?

2. Exhaust must exit behind the centerline between the front and rear axle. The exhaust tips may not extend further than 3 inches beyond the bodywork. I think we should add something about waste gate dumps. It’s something that isn’t really talked about in the GCR. I think they should be allowed as long as they are pointed towards the ground and the earliest point possible from the turbo.

3. Unleaded gasoline and E-85 are the only fuels permitted. What if someone wants to use methanol injection to help with detonation?


E. Suspension/Brakes/Tires/Wheels

3. Aftermarket active suspension is prohibited. Vehicles with OEM semi-active or active suspension are permitted to use the OEM system in an unmodified form. How would you go about enforcing this?

5. All tires must be available to other SCCA Time Trial competitors in the Street Unlimited Class for purchase. If any tires are found to be of a cheater compound the competitor will be disqualified and no refund will be issued. I don’t think this is really necessary. How would you test for this?

6. Upper 1/4 of the wheel and tire may not extend past the widest point of the wheel arch when viewed from above. I think it would make more sense to have a tire size rule based on drive train layout then it would to try and judge something like this.